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[05:18] [alkisg] pem725, how are your fat clients today? :)
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[07:54] [pem725] alkisg: clients seem to hang just after mount commands fail. I am checking into this further.
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[08:45] [pem725] alkisg: my fat clients won't boot. They hang after a few mount errors - status 1 - saying they were already mounted.
[08:45] [pem725] do you think this is a problem with nfs competing with ssh?
[08:45] [alkisg] pem725: that's Usual", not the actual error
[08:45] [alkisg] Ubuntu doesn't use nfs by dfault
[08:46] [alkisg] default
[08:46] [alkisg] So try to remove "quiet splash" from /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default, to better see any error messages
[08:46] [pem725] yeah, I might have gotten my instructions messed up and installed nfs and setup my exports. I will kill that just in case.
[08:46] [pem725] ok
[08:51] [pem725] alkisg: I got it to boot and now it boots to a login prompt.
[08:51] [alkisg] X login or console login?
[08:51] [pem725] I did two things...stopped nfs (and commented out export line) and got rid of quiet splash.
[08:52] [pem725] console login
[08:52] [alkisg] That might be a graphics driver problem. What graphics cards do you clients have?
[08:53] [pem725] nvidia
[08:53] [pem725] I used this command to setup the fatclient:
[08:53] [alkisg] Lucid or Karmic?
[08:53] [pem725] ltsp-build-client --arch i386 --fat-client --fat-client xubuntu-desktop
[08:53] [alkisg] Ouch
[08:53] [pem725] would that be sufficient to get me an x login?
[08:53] [pem725] Karmic
[08:53] [pem725] uh oh...
[08:54] [alkisg] I don't think anyone has tried xubuntu-desktop with fat clients...
[08:54] [alkisg] What DM does xubuntu have?
[08:54] [pem725] xfce
[08:54] [alkisg] (display manager, like gdm or kdm)
[08:54] [pem725] oh, sorry...usually gdm
[08:54] [alkisg] Ah, if it's gdm it should work then
[08:54] [pem725] I probably need to install gdm in the chroot, right?
[08:55] [alkisg] If xubuntu-desktop depends on that, it should already be installed
[08:55] [alkisg] Is that the actual command line that you used?
[08:55] [pem725] I can start from scratch with gnome just to get one up and going.
[08:55] [pem725] yes
[08:55] [alkisg] Or did you use --fat-client-desktop ?
[08:55] [pem725] nope, I used the one I pasted into the IRC
[08:55] [alkisg] Then you have an ubuntu desktop :)
[08:56] [alkisg] The command line parameter to select a xubuntu desktop would be --fat-client-desktop
[08:56] [alkisg] OK, so: sudo gedit /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
[08:56] [alkisg] In that, put:
[08:56] [alkisg] [Default]
[08:56] [alkisg] XSERVER=vesa
[08:56] [alkisg] And reboot your client...
[08:57] [pem725] OK
[08:59] [pem725] still gives me a console login.
[08:59] [alkisg] What's your ltsp version? dpkg -l ltsp-server
[08:59] [pem725] I will start over with the build client just to make sure I get this right.
[09:00] [pem725] 5.2-0ubuntu2~ppa1~karmic1
[09:00] [pem725] what command should I use to build the fat client?
[09:01] [alkisg] Let me give you an ltsp-build-client.conf
[09:01] [pem725] ok
[09:02] [alkisg] sudo mkdir -p /etc/ltsp
[09:02] [alkisg] sudo gedit /etc/ltsp/ltsp-build-client.conf
[09:02] [alkisg] And paste those lines:
[09:02] [alkisg] ARCH=i386
[09:02] [alkisg] FAT_CLIENT_DESKTOPS="ubuntu-desktop"
[09:02] [alkisg] MOUNT_PACKAGE_DIR="/var/cache/apt/archives"
[09:02] [alkisg] Then just run sudo ltsp-build-client with no parameters at all.
[09:03] [alkisg] Do you have an non-english locale?
[09:03] [alkisg] If so, you might also add something like LOCALE="el_GR.UTF-8"
[09:04] [pem725] no non-english locale.
[09:04] [alkisg] OK
[09:04] [alkisg] Check the ltsp-build-client output for any errors
[09:04] [pem725] I am rm -rf my previous fat client.
[09:04] [alkisg] OK
[09:06] [pem725] so when it builds the fatclient, does it put in soft links to existing software installed on the server or must I install the software I want to run locally into the chroot?
[09:08] [alkisg] It installs about what you can find in a live ubuntu cd
[09:08] [pem725] got it.
[09:08] [alkisg] So if you want more, you must install it manually after the building is done
[09:09] [pem725] when I want say google-chrome, I need to install it in the chroot, right?
[09:09] [alkisg] Right
[09:09] [pem725] I'm going to try another client than my previous this go around.
[09:10] [alkisg] You could also add a LATE_PACKAGES in ltsp-build-client.conf
[09:10] [pem725] the client I kept getting a console login was an eeepc
[09:10] [alkisg] And add any packages you wanted to install there
[09:10] [pem725] ah, perfect.
[09:10] [pem725] that would be great.
[09:10] [alkisg] And EARLY_MIRRORS for any mirrors (like, for chrome)
[09:11] [pem725] do you suggest I build clients from scratch when updating or just apt-get update/upgrade in the chroot?
[09:11] [alkisg] update/upgrade
[09:11] [alkisg] Unless you upgrade to lucid, where a new ltsp-build-client would be better.
[09:12] [pem725] OK
[09:12] [pem725] how far is lucid along now?
[09:12] [pem725] is it ready for install in a production environment?
[09:12] [alkisg] Nope. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidReleaseSchedule
[09:12] [pem725] k
[09:13] [alkisg] I do work with it on my laptop, it's stable enough, but it's still alpha, not in any way ready for production
[09:13] [pem725] good to know.
[09:13] [pem725] I usually hold back from upgrades for about 4-6 months.
[09:13] [alkisg] But for fat client tests it might be more stable than karmic :D
[09:13] [pem725] post release.
[09:13] [pem725] yeah, that is why I asked.
[09:13] [pem725] I figured it might be the case.
[09:14] [pem725] does order matter in the ltsp-build-client.conf file?
[09:14] [alkisg] No
[09:14] [pem725] OK
[09:14] [alkisg] Hmmm maybe I should write a small wiki page for fat clients...
[09:14] [pem725] that would be great.
[09:15] [pem725] if you need someone to try out your steps, I would be a happy and willing participant.
[09:15] [alkisg] OK, I'll do that now.
[09:16] [pem725] is there a man page or some online docs for ltsp-build-client.conf?
[09:16] [alkisg] I've made a GUI for building fat client chroots and managing them, but it's mostly in Greek... :-/
[09:16] [alkisg] Nope
[09:16] [pem725] I always wanted to learn Greek.
[09:16] [pem725] probably not the best time to learn though...
[09:16] [alkisg] Heh :)
[09:17] [alkisg] OK, trying the non-GUI way, to write the wiki page...
[09:17] [pem725] when I specify LATE_PACKAGES, do I space separate the packages or put them in quotes, or what?
[09:18] [johnny] alkisg, considered trying to see if packagekit could use a chroot to install into?
[09:18] [johnny] or even ubuntu software center?
[09:18] [alkisg] pem725: space separated
[09:18] [alkisg] johnny: I've never tried packagekit...
[09:18] [pem725] alkisg: no quotes, right?
[09:19] [johnny] imo.. if you want to make it easy to install apps into a chroot, you should use the same gui tools that are on the server
[09:19] [alkisg] pem725: LATE_PACKAGES="package1 package2"
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[09:19] [pem725] ah, perfect.
[09:19] [johnny] alkisg, and if you use packagekit directly.. you get tools that work on many distros
[09:19] [pem725] how about for MIRRORS?
[09:19] [pem725] same?
[09:19] [alkisg] johnny: I think the best way would be to use a different partition on the server, and *boot with it normally* to manage the chroot :)
[09:19] [johnny] including all supported distros by ltsp
[09:19] [johnny] sure.. except this time.. no booting
[09:19] [johnny] that's a big deal imo
[09:19] [johnny] would be better if you could say
[09:20] [johnny] $packagekitapi --root=/path/to/chroot
[09:20] [alkisg] nbd can even export the new partition directly, so no ltsp-update-image anymore
[09:20] [johnny] or perhaps even a wrapper around it
[09:20] [johnny] partitions suck too
[09:20] [johnny] too much effort for the user
[09:20] [johnny] unless they were lvm by default
[09:20] [alkisg] A .vmdk (vbox disk) would be fine as well...
[09:21] [alkisg] And they could manage it with vbox
[09:21] [johnny] except that's not open is it..
[09:21] [johnny] oh.. wait.. i think i have it backwards
[09:21] [alkisg] The format? I'd bet it is...
[09:21] [johnny] for some reason i was thinking vmware..
[09:21] [johnny] not virtualbox :)
[09:21] [alkisg] Even lxc (linux containers) could be useful for managing the chroot
[09:22] [johnny] you could.. but i think trying to use the open tools we have right now woulc be good
[09:22] [johnny] and would make packagekit more useful..
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[09:22] [johnny] not just for fat clients too alkisg ..
[09:22] [johnny] but regular ltsp clients with local apps
[09:23] [johnny] which you can't rely on booting from to be able to install anything
[09:23] [alkisg] johnny: is packagekit available for ubuntu right now?
[09:23] [alkisg] Or is it something that needs work to get integrated?
[09:23] [johnny] thought it was..
[09:23] [johnny] it works on debian a bit
[09:24] [johnny] it's nowhere near as good at apt directly
[09:24] [alkisg] Well it'd be better if we relied on *existing* technologies :D
[09:24] [johnny] but for just installing and removing packages
[09:24] [johnny] it works for installing and removing software on multiple distros
[09:24] [johnny] including gentoo now i heard
[09:25] [johnny] i heard that months ago actually..
[09:25] [johnny] alkisg, packagekit is just a wrapper for common functions around the distro specific ways of doing it
[09:25] [johnny] it also integrates with policykit
[09:25] [alkisg] For me, fat clients should be managed from a GUI, like vbox or another server partition. That would allow the admin to even use sabayon, gconf etc to manage his chroot.
[09:26] [alkisg] I don't see any reason for adding another layer of management
[09:26] [johnny] sure.. but you're forgetting regular chroots..
[09:26] [johnny] with localapps
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